THEFT OF CATTLE BEING NON BAILABLE.
HERE IS WHERE I HAVE A PROBLEM.
1.Zambia has been built principally from copper ,even though gold and emerals is more valuable than copper which is also more valuable than cattle ,we can safely say that Copper has been our most treasured resource.
Copper thefts are very rampant and we lose millions throught such thefts.COPPER THEFT REMAINS A BAILABLE OFFENCE and so is Gold and other precious minerals.
2.Motor vehicles are ow⁴ned by many Zambians in every region of this country and the price of one vehicle cannot be compared to the price of one cow or a goat.Motor vehicle theft was Non bailable but the law was amended to make it bailable because the law in the first place was made non bailable because the crafters of the law were targeting some individuals.The lesson is that a law must never be made targeting an individual or individuals.
3.The presumption of innocence holds that a person is innocent when suspected to have committed a crime until hes proven guilty.The arguments that cases must be made bailable is so as to deter excessive punishment before one is convicted..A lot of people who have been suspected of committing crimes that are not bailable have spent years in Prison walls only to be declared innocent .. but imagine the the suffering they are subjected to…
The argument here is not that Cattle thieves should not be harshly punished ,they should be severely punished because even cattle is valuable but the contention is making suspects of cattle thefts spend years in prison ..
4.This law will cause trouble in areas where they practice open grazing .There are areas where anyone can take their animals to graze and it is possible that one animal can stray into another group of cattle and anyone can simply allege that another has stole their cow and by the time the courts would have been proving otherwise ,the accused would have languished in prison walls .
THE LAW MUST NEVER BE TRARGETED AND WE ARE MOVING TOWARDS LESS AND MORE HUMANE OFFENDER MANAGEMENT AND SO THIS PROPOSED LAW IS RETROGRESSIVE.
BINWELL MPUNDU
NKANA MP
UMWINA NKANA
The reason for behind that is it take more than five years for the cases to be finalized in our courts meantime the fellows who are on bail continue stealing Animals. We saw how it was with motor vehicle after the case became non bailable stealing vehicles reduced tremendously. By the way I have not heard that it was amended, the case of Esther Lungu is that she is on bond and not on bail, should the police revoke her bond she can’t apply for bail because it’s non bailable.
Since you are an mp kindly propose to the Executive to amend the law on copper theft also. As the cattle there is a nuisance and we need to cure that.
It’s livestock not cattle..the whole idea is to protect that form of property which has a bearing on poverty reduction and economic empowerment..how many rural dwellers received some form of livestock as empowerment either from government or NGO’s?…obviously we know the answer..on the other side how many Zambians have had their hands on copper?..
It’s livestock not cattle..the whole idea is to protect that form of property which has a bearing on poverty reduction and economic empowerment..how many rural dwellers received some form of livestock as empowerment either from government or NGO’s?…obviously we know the answer..on the other side how many Zambians have had their hands on copper?..the government is just protecting the poor. The government has never distributed copper to empowerment the poor
BIN-WELO,
Just stop stealing cows
Copper is at most public resource, owned, as in Zambia only by the govt until the private mining company mines it and processes it. This same private mining company is big complex company, therefore not easy for a common criminal to steal from it. It takes sofiscated complex criminals to do that. So stealing from these companies is not cheap, and is not for kaponya kabwalalas. This itself is deterent to many would be thief and majority dont even give it a try. In this regard i think then we can afford to hv copper thefts bailable just on grounds that it is not as common. In the case of cattle thieves, these are common criminals who terrorise poor pipo in rural areas. Bcos the victims are poor, they rarely pose a threat to the thieves. The thieves can even jeer at their victims. The number of such thieves is ever increasing bcos anyone can join to steal from poor pipo who cant even afford a lawyer. Without making the law stiffer, cases of stock theft increase more, but with ever increasing poor victims comes in the logic of making the law stiffer. I therefore support govt 100% making cattle theft unbailable.
LET US ANALYSE THE VALIDITY AND SOUNDNESS OF BINWILL MPUNDU’S ARGUMENT
HIS PREMISE 1
Zambia has been built principally from copper.
HIS PREMISE 2
Gold and emerals is more valuable than copper which is also more valuable than cattle.
HIS CONCLUSION:
We can safely say that Copper has been our most treasured resource.
MY EXPLANATION:
The argument is valid but the conclusion is false.
The conclusion is false/ or an argument can be said to have invalid conclusion if the major premise or first statement is not true.
1. In this case the first premise is not true. Copper is not the most valuable thing in all regions of Zambia.
What was more valuable before the discovery of copper?
2. If you ask local people from Western and Southern provinces, they will tell you that cattle are more valuable than copper because for them with cattle you can get anything and that is what they have had from time immemorial. For most of them to acquire anything or to take their children to school they depend on cattle.
3. Most of them have bought vehicles and built houses by selling cattle. Others started businesses with money from cattle.
Similarly, how can a vehicle which is bought out of selling cattle be more valuable than the source?
By the rules of logic this argument is not sound because premises do not support the conclusion.
Philopher, why don’t we have 10 of your kind on this Blog? Not some of the Riffraffs with empty heads who daily dwell on criticising only one person and spewing toxic Tribal tirades and and vitrol on this Blog. Your analysis is like fresh air and odourless!!! It is evident from your reasoning that you must have spent some time in School!!
Hon MP, there are few things here that make your argument weak;
1. your caparison may not be appropriate for this kind of scenario because you are comparing Copper, a Company or National property to Cattle which is personal property. Copper is already in the ground but it takes a long time to raise animals, it takes years and not days, weeks or months like broiler chickens. Imagine after those many years, someone just comes in a day or night and steals everything, it’s like killing that person because his livelihood is completely shattered. That is unacceptable.
2. You are also looking at the value of the property rather than looking at the problem. The problem at hand here is stock theft and not the value of cattle. Some offenses carry stiffer punishment because of the perpetuity by the offenders and not necessarily the value of the property stolen. The offenders are aware of the bad things they do but they don’t stop because of the weak laws used for some offenses. Go to Arab countries where they use tough Sharia laws, you can’t steal a spoon or a newspaper there, if it means cutting your d**k, they can do it without mercy, there is no compromise on their property safety. So tough laws are also meant to detour or discourage the would be offenders.
3. There are rules which govern the communities, an animal which has strayed in your kraal cannot have you tagged as a cattle wrestler. When such an animal comes to you, all what you need to do is to inform the headman or the even the Chief and you will have covered yourself. But if you keep quiet. People can be suspicious and can accuse you of having some ill intentions about the animal.
Then you are saying that you have a problem with this proposed law but don’t forget that the cattle owners who face the actual problem are having a more problem than you. Their animals which take them many years to raise and where they depend for their livelihood are rampantly stolen every day. In my opinion toughening rules for stock thefts seems to be the best and lasting solution to the never ending problem. Let us protect property owners and their property and not property thieves. If I were an MP like Hon. Mpundu, I would support the motion. I don’t think the law is targeting any particular group or people but it’s targeting stock thieves wherever they may be in the country.